Going to take the plunge ........

Discussion in 'EVs and Hybrids' started by Phil, Feb 8, 2020.

  1. Phil
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    ....... into an EV.....

    Hi all, I've not been on here for a while but thought I would come back aboard with this post. The subject can raise quite, interesting, but often polarised views.

    Firstly, the EV will replace my wife's car and I'll be keeping mine, so it's quite a 'safe' plunge really.

    I've been doing a lot of research into EV ownership and for our circumstances we shouldn't be affected by the obvious compromises. I'll have a home charger fitted and will be able to charge overnight, every night and, if, we choose to, the maximum round trip in any one day would be 200 miles, so doable. Once we are comfortable and have gained experience and confidence I'm sure we will venture further afield.

    The cars; I'm down to a Tesla 3 or Jag I-Pace and have test driven both.

    Everything I've read about speed and instant torque is absolutely true, these are very quick cars. Given people will buy these to spend their lives doing the daily school runs, supermarkets and motorway commutes the future will different, performance will not be a differentiator.

    The stats show the Tesla is quicker however it's the law of diminishing returns and in the real world is (for me) irrelevant. Are they boring ? silent, essentially single geared, heavy ..... yes. ..... boring .... for me no. (cue polarised views !! ). The four wheel drive, instant torque at any speed and the regen braking is different, and could quite possibly become addictive.

    The I-Pace is classed as an SUV but you sit, quite low in it and it feels long, probably due to the front wheels and cabin being further forward than normal (ICE !) cars. The cabin is familiar Jaguar and is a nice place to be. The HSE seats are particularly nice (although I think I'd go for the entry S model and spec to what I'd want. Nb it is typical Jag, BM, Merc etc where you have to pay extra for what should be standard nowadays; heated seats, folding mirrors etc..... although a heated steering wheel is standard .... go figure .... !!).

    The Tesla is a different matter, it's all about the tech. The massive screen controls the majority of functions and undoubtedly would take some getting used too, but like everything I sure you would do so quickly enough. Unlike Jag it comes well spec'd as standard and there are very few options, colour, wheels, tow bar etc. Although you can order the full self drive option, which is possibly a unique selling point, but not a deciding factor for me at present.

    Would love to hear your thoughts and views....
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2020
  2. Mieke
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    Mieke WARLORD Site Supporter

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    Are you looking to buy or to lease? How do the prices compare between the two? Presumably you get the current £3500 grant with any EV at the moment. Keep us up to date on progress. (y)
     
  3. Phil
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    I'm fortunate and will be able to fund as a company car. The govn is incentivising ULEV'S and EV'S via a 0% BIK for 20/21 tax year, 1% the following year & 2% the year after. With the grant it means I'll be paying approx half the lease costs of an equivalently priced petrol/diesel SUV.

    There is also currently a grant for the home charger and the lease company I'll be using is offering free fitment as an incentive for orders before end of March.

    It's a moment in time thing and as said I'll be keeping my car so its bit of a no brainer all round really.
     
  4. Kev2005
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    Kev2005 WARLORD Site Supporter Good Egg

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    Did you look at the Ford Mustang E-Mach? Any good? I heard about it but not seen one yet.

    Kev
     
  5. Phil
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    I haven't as I'm looking to buy now and the Mustang isn't available yet, however it looks really interesting and will be competitively priced.

    I may be being a little melodramtic but I honestly think we are at an historic turning point over the next couple of years but there obviously needs to be a sea change in the infrastructure if the 2035 target has any chance of being met. Who knows whether there will be !!
     
  6. Phil
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    Here's a thought ..... in 5/10 years time a common question on this site could be .... "Can anyone recommend a reliable indy software programmer..."
     
  7. rigeng
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    No doubt you're right, but that one sentence is enough to put me off even thinking of buying an electric car!
     
  8. Mieke
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    Mieke WARLORD Site Supporter

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    I'm still a bit dubious of all the hype being talked about EVs. The government and politicians in general are very good at talking, but putting plans into action is a different thing. I cannot see that enough charging infrastructure will be installed by 2035 for everyone to make the change to EV. There will be years of traffic chaos while they dig up every street in towns and cities. :whistle:
     
  9. a.s.uk
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    Don’t forget guys
    It’s only new cars that will not be available from 2035 onwards, in diesel and petrol form...
    There will still be all the existing cars around from prior to that date... including any that may be sold in bargain price format, at the end of the year 2034....
    I just can’t see how this infrastructure is going g to stack up and cope... I was at Meadowhall yesterday, and all the newly installed chargers in the car park were already fully utilised..... so where is everyone going to plug in.....?? Let alone all the cars parked in the streets
    My own thoughts are each manufacturer has blasted off into electric car production, but no ones really thought whether the individual countries infrastructure will be able to manage..
    and so the debate continues.


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  10. Phil
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    Totally agree, now that I'm getting one I've become vigilant to where I could recharge if necessary and it's very apparent that the infrastructure will be unable to support even the current low volume sales and as @Mieke points out we are looking at massive disruption to support a mainstream public EV car park.
     
  11. K777
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    The big screen on the Tesla doesn't do it for me. On the Panamera to operate the centre vents you need to alter flow and direction on the screen, its dangerous imho as its to much time looking down at the screen and not the road.

    I got my Panamera hybrids mainly due to the BIK, as the comparable ICE only car is insane tax.
    They do alter the goalposts though, so expect it to start costing you more as years go by.
    As an example, they have moved the CO2 levels since my first in 2015, there's no first year full tax allowance on my hybrids anymore, and RFL is £440 for second year, and the BIK is more than previous ones.

    My biz partner is ordering a Taycan, but I am still not convinced of the number of charge points for a full EV. - incidentally motorway ones were free in 2015 - not anymore.

    At the village hotel near us I have seen the two Tesla charging stations go from having no cars there, to these days, theres a queue mid day of maybe 3 or 4.
    If you go onto Tesla stations are, I imagine most of your charging will be done a home, the Village Hotel is the only one in Leeds.

    But, even with my experience, I am still considering a Taycan too, especially after TG last night.
     
  12. 535i MSport
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    535i MSport

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    Zero tax from April is tempting, but I too would worry about having to queue to charge. Can you imagine having to wait an hour for 2 people in front of you to charge, before it’s your turn?

    At least with a hybrid, you have a tank to fall back on, but does the weight of the batteries compromise the car?

    I too have a choice to make, as to car Vs car allowance, but I am favouring the allowance at the moment.



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  13. K777
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    The weight does, but then theres no engine etc, but certainly its heavier, but ultimately I think the manufacturers have that dealt with the power thats available and other changes.
    As an example the wheel bearings in my car are different to an standard Porsche, and it just rolls and rolls.

    But I agree with the engine to fall back up on. I have a photo of a Tesla on a recovery truck at the village hotel coming to get charged as it ran out.
     
  14. Phil
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    The Taycan did look really impressive; looks like a 'Porsche' and amazing performance. Will be interesting to see how the Supercar manufacturers respond over the next couple of years.

    As a main car and particularly a company car that's needed for high daily mileage I think they are a non starter at the moment, however as a second car or a low mileage commuter with effective home charging, they are financially very appealing, if, you can purchase as a company car. The I-Pace with options lists at c£73k, which is similar to my RRS, yet the monthly payments will be around half.
     
  15. K777
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    A hybrid for our engineers doing 25k miles a year is pointless from the companies point of view, we have however recognised that the staff can make a massive saving on their own BIK (tax liability) by switching to hybrid. The guy in the X4 2.0D is likely going to change to a 530e as a result.

    Heres my thinking about full EV - as it looks like i am going down the Taycan route too.

    I do maybe 200 miles a week, the battery capacity of a Taycan Turbo is 93.4kwh, at a cost (at home and work) of aprox 14p per Kwh to charge, meaning I can fill from empty for £13. Its range is 236-280, so based on 236 for £100 worth of "fuel" i can get 1815 miles.

    Having looked at my last couple of years trips, have been London 2 times each year- 440 round trips, and Scotland for 4 days doing 1000 miles last year. So the occasions I need to charge at a public charger are few.

    I can charge at home and work, and so will be a top up charge mostly once or twice daily, so in theory should have virtually full charge at a moments notice.

    As it happens, "Mrs" Mc is changing her car and looking at an XC60 or 40 if the 60 is too big, so that can be used for any massive trips whilst the super-fast chargers (69p/kwh !!) are being built, as appose to the slower ones at the motorway - 30p per kwh.

    Why the Turbo ? The turbo is a better package and ( remembering no Porsche is sold at basic price) will not be much more than a spec'ed up basic Taycan 4s, I will still be better off BIK than the Hybrid, and the company can benefit from 100% capital allowance on the first year - something the govt changed on the Panamera Hybrid ( now 18% per year same as an ICE only car)
    Plus its outrageously fast :wobble:. I appreciate these cars are ridiculous money, but considering say an M8 which I love, they aren't really. Considering BIK, the tax allowance for the co, and the fuel saving - all what we calculate when we look at cars, its a good financial option comparatively.
    At least thats what me and my biz partner say to each other :rofll:
     
  16. 535i MSport
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    Using my man maths calculator, I could probably run an M340i touring for £2000 to £3000 PA more than a 330e touring company car, so that is most likely at the moment. And having not had a cc for 5 years, the idea of having the same car for 4 years without being able to change it, is off putting.


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  17. Phil
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    I've used the same rationale for the I-Pace ....... although I have to use a slightly different rationale to justify the cost of my RRS
    :):rofll:

    I don't blame you.... sadly, I always start thinking about my (or the wifes !!) next car within six months of getting a new one ...... it's an affliction. :ohyes:
     
  18. aldo
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    [​IMG]

    Particularly relevant for today


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  19. Mieke
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    Mieke WARLORD Site Supporter

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    That does make you wonder about the dangers of being stuck in a flood in an EV with 800 volts of electricity. :eek:
     
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  20. Merc? No. BM!
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    Merc? No. BM! WARLORD Site Supporter

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    :eek::eek:
    And that’s just me being shocked at the use of the comma... :D
     

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