Ownership Diary - Bürstner Argos 747-2G

So here we go - another Spuff Adventure wagon incoming!

Following the px of my 2023 Knaus BoxDrive 600XL I bought from new, I have secured the following motorhome which is far more suitable for the needs of our newly expanded family of 5! Anyone who has a remote interest in the leisure vehicle market and/or has more than two children will know that finding a vehicle capable of (safely) carrying 5+ people with proper 3-point belts with enough room to properly live, plus maintain comfortable temperatures and living conditions in all seasons is almost impossible.

There are a number of options in the c. 7m coach built sector, but they tend to be poorly built and insulated and be designed around a pullman dinette which is particularly unfriendly for lounging. Build quality is poor and winterisation non-existent.

Then there’s a few vans - some A-classes which have belts for four plus occasional rear-facing, lap belt only options. They tend to be expensive and also quite cramped living conditions.

Then you have a massive gap up in price to around £200k+ for the Dethleffs XXXL Globetrotter type thing which ultimately is a similar layout to what I’ve bought but built on a Iveco Daily 7.5t. And on top of that the ultimate European motorhomes - Morelo and Concorde who build 5-seat bar-layouts (which would be perfect) but upwards of £300k to £750k.

In the middle, the pickings are slim to say the least. Currently only Dethleffs make the Family XL which could work but is only available new at £140k. We thought about it quite seriously but upon finding the one we’ve bought, we decided to bank the additional £50k in favour of a van 4yrs younger but ever so slightly better specced and finished.

Introducing the Bürstner Argos 747-2G! Bürstner have a very solid reputation as builders of mid-high quality motorhomes. The Argos has been built in a similar design and feature list for over 20yrs until it was phased out in 2021, just a year after my van was built. It’s fully winterised (all water tanks located inboard), double-floor for insulation, with underfloor heating and wet central heating throughout the vehicle. It is of similar construction and heating as my previous Concorde Charisma I in which I used to live full-time and I took to the Austrian Alps in -26C and enjoyed living in +25C inside.



It’s a 2020 van on a Fiat Ducato X290 chassis with a 2.3l 4-cylinder engine, upgraded to 180bhp from factory and mated to a 9spd ZF auto gearbox. It’s a one owner vehicle and has 18,250miles under its wheels. As I understand it, it’s rated to 5t GMVW, requiring a C1 license and giving 750kg of payload. It is 8.9m long, 2.35m wide, 3.3m high. Water tanks of 125l fresh water and c. 110l of grey water with a toilet cassette capacity of c. 20litres. It has 6 belts - two in the cab, four around the pullman dinette (which converts, together with the side sofa into a U-shaped lounge) and a heat exchanger runs the central heating from the engine coolant whilst on the move.

In preparation for sale and as part of the negotiation process, the dealership replaced all six tyres with brand new Continental VanCo 4Seasons, new cambelt, engine service & MOT. Plus run through a list of a snagging items we spotted (none of them material) when we viewed. I have had them add 2x11kg Gaslow (refillable) LPG bottles so that I can fill up with gas at service stations still selling LPG (noting this has diminished in the UK). In theory, I was collecting it tomorrow (23rd Jan) but this has been pushed out a day since it’s throwing an AdBlue warning light which the mechanic thinks is a faulty sensor, so that’s being sorted before collection on Friday.

In terms of upgrades, in order of urgency, the following in focus:

• Replace 2x95aH AGM batteries for 1x230aH LifePO4 lithium battery. EcoTree battery ordered and en route to Premium Motorhomes who will fit this. Saving 30kg of payload in the replacement of the AGM batteries which weigh 26.2kg each! Gaining 135aH additional useable energy in the process;
• Premium Motorhomes is upgrading my mains & solar chargers, rewiring the existing 2kW inverter to run all AC sockets when not on Electric Hookup (so we’re fully off grid capable as I was in my previous van) and looking to wire the habitation aircon so that it can be used on the move. Booked in for 11th & 12th Feb;
• Upgrade shower head to a Ecocamel aerated head for more power plus water saving (bought, will fit myself);
• General Ecology Nature Pure Water Filter - bought and will fit myself to filter all tap water to kitchen tap. Filters virtually all water born viruses and bacteria to safeguard water supply for drinking & cooking without any need for additional filtration and provide peace of mind when taking up water across Europe;
• Taylormade SilverScreens - ordered and being made. Expected shortly. These are to cover the cab windows to provide more thermal insulation during summer or winter;
• Additional 2x Thetford Toilet Cassettes - bought and will be stored in the motorhome garage. Particularly with a large family, it is the toilet which fills first and needs emptying before you need more fresh water. This prolongs the period we can be offgrid.

To be ordered/fitted:

• Semi-air suspension - I’d love full air suspension but at c. £10k, it’s an expense too far and we’ll live with the anecdotally crashy Ducato suspension. However, in order to have properly usable payload and stay the right side of the law, we’re looking to upgrade to rear air suspension on the tag axle in order to gain c. 500kg of payload plus make entry and egress from ferries a lot easier without grounding out the rear given the overhang. Unfortunately it’s c. £3.5k fitted but we’ve budgeted for it in our calculations and likely to get this done prior to Summer.
• Once suspension is done, then we'll fit a 4-bike rear bike rack to the rear external garage wall as we'll be unable to carry all our bikes plus the rest of our kit in the garage. But the suspension upgrade is critical to this given the mass so far away from the fulcrum of the most rearward axle.

All in all the family is so very excited. Mrs Spuff, who lost the love of motor homing when we had my last camper van, is particularly excited. She loved my Concorde and the Argos feels very similar in layout and size. The kids are excited and we’re now looking forward to what this offers us as opportunity for proper holidays and memory making with the kids. My eldest is 12 and it’s not lost on us that it won’t be long before she won’t want to spend time with us going forwards. We want to maximise the opportunity we have with her with us and spending time with the boys whilst they are young also.

So far we have already booked the following:

- April / Easter Half-Term - Ireland - Wild Atlantic Way! We've always wanted to do it. My Wife is half Irish but it's been a long time since she was down there and equally a long time for myself (c. 30yrs). Having been caught up in the mayhem of Holyhead issue at Christmas, Stena provided me a voucher for 50% on that sailing route this year. That, together with my Stena Gold membership, brought the cost of the crossing (incl cabins) down to £420 return on a fully flex ticket. We'll have 13 days on the Emerald Isle - so 10days of touring and a bit of time with family in Dublin;
- Summer 2025 - Austria - we've booked at the Zugspitze Resort in the lowlands of the Alps. We've got a pitch on a campsite in the grounds of a 4* hotel with loads of things to do with the kids both indoors and out. We'll take 4days travelling down and back each way and then 9nights in Austria at the campsite. Always wanted to go motorhoming in Austria in the Summer and this looks perfect for a young family.
- February 2026 - French Alps - already looking at booking a campsite in Chatel as a base for a week's skiing at half-term. We've been struggling with the cost of ski holidays recently. Looking at up to £12k for a week, which is just uneconomic. This way we get to do it for less than half that all in - one of the prime reasons for getting a motorhome which can cope in the winter conditions.

I guess the plan is to document the ownership of this van in the same way as others; the ups, downs and adventures with it! In the next few weeks I'll be up to Premium Motorhomes to get the electrics done and will have a solo overnight or two up there in Doncaster. Then we may look at a few days for Feb half-term. Plus my daughter and I are looking at a two-up trip as a repeater of our Ullswater adventure in the snow last March - currently looking at a weekend in the Peak District or on the coast at Saltburn on Sea. Then I'll take my eldest boy somewhere a bit more local - just continue to shake down over the coming months in preparation for Ireland and beyond.

Excited doesn't cut it as a description of how we're all feeling!

 

Thanks chaps.

Unfortunately, I may have jinxed it in my excitement to get going with it.

Got a phonecall this morning from the dealership saying the AdBlue light was still on in spite of the mechanic changing the sensor and checking the system for sludge. They then phoned the previous owners to ask if it had been a problem previously and the answer was "yes" and it had been in to Fiat twice for a new AdBlue tank and that Fiat had told them driving with the light on wouldn't be an issue.

As you can imagine, both dealer and myself are not overly happy with the response. The dealer has invested a lot in prepping the vehicle for sale (tyres, servicing, cambelt, hab check/service) and I have invested my dreams and confidence in it. Initial reaction was to pull out but then I chucked it over and over in my head and with the wife and we've proposed a way forward.

We've proposed that the vehicle be taken to a Fiat Commercial Dealer for a full diagnostics run, any work required to get it up to scratch and a copy of the report/work carried out. Plus a further discount of £[TBD]k to cover the fact I'm still on the hook for the campervan finance (the PX) until handover of the new one and a slush fund to cover rectifying this issue in future if it rears its head again. This offer is currently with the dealer to negotiate with the current owner. I'm of the opinion that all vehicles have faults - nature of the beast - so it's mitigating that as much as possible and taking a less emotional view and calculated risk-based approach.

The only solace I'm taking at the moment is that I've found an webpage from a Fiat dealer in Australia which seems to suggest that if AdBlue consumption is above 9l/100km over the whole life of the vehicle, the light will remain on constantly. This high consumption is generally down to heavily loaded and unaerodynamic vehicles (like large coachbuilt motorhomes) and is normal enough - it's just that the system is calibrated for lower consumption levels so would see it as being outside parameters.

But I would like this verified by someone who sees these vehicles all the time.

Watch this space. It's not a done deal by a long way - if I have to send the battery back, cancel the electrics upgrades, ferries and insurance, I will do.

 

Yeah, EEAST are the same

TBF - I loved the Sprinters too. Both as motorhomes and when I was working off the Ambulances.

 

Thanks guys. Sadly, I've just received a call from the Dealer saying they're refusing to retail it. They feel misled over the issue and don't want to put their necks on the line to underwrite something which has had a problem throughout its life and has yet to be solved. They're very disappointed since they've invested in new tyres, Gaslow, engine service and will now unlikely see that money from the owners, but don't have the confidence in it to sell it. I feel for them almost as much as I feel for myself right now.

The whole family is reeling. My daughter & wife are really upset. We've set so many dreams in play for this.

However, I'm trying to look at it through the lense of having been saved from ourselves. This morning we were ready to take it for a discount of another couple of grand. I think inevitably, if I'm honest to myself, I would have been annoyed at this issue over the longer term. So perhaps this is for the best.

Now the search continues. Thin pickings, as I described above. There's one other van (a bit newer but similar spec) but I think that's already had a deposit on it as I enquired on it previously. Otherwise all the others are Euro5 and whilst that in itself sounds very attractive in the context of the issues I'm reading around with AdBlue in the last 48hrs, I'd be concerned over the next 10yrs that this will increasingly exclude us from places we want to visit or necessitate long diversions to avoid ULEZ zones.

Let's see.

 

Thanks - that was the one post I found which made sense/almost got my head around taking the vehicle.

Agreed, actually sent a very positive signal to me that they’re a trusted place to buy from and would do so if they had anything else suitable in stock.

Thank you! None of those work, unfortunately. We need 5 seatbelts and a decent amount of space.

 

Wife and I have regrouped and reflected on what we want and what kind of budget we’re willing to deploy for the right van.

We flirted with a different van for a bit before the Bürstner. We’ve not seen one in the flesh yet but from spec and set-up, it looks like it’s right up our street. We’ve put down a holding deposit on something like this. This is a picture of the one which was sold before Christmas. “Ours” is on the new Fiat chassis, if I understand correctly, but this gives you a feel:

https://www.motorhomes.co.uk/stock/dethleffs-xl-a-family-a-7872-2-4201/

It’s arriving into the country from the factory on Wednesday and we’ll be heading up to the dealer on Saturday lunchtime to pour over it with the kids in tow.